Comments on: Blog Tribute #3, The Mookse and the Gripes: The Humbling, by Philip Roth http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/ This blogger seems to like every Australian writer but me -- P. Carey Fri, 03 May 2013 01:56:54 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.com/ By: KevinfromCanada http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2327 Fri, 22 Jan 2010 18:06:58 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2327 Good point, Trevor — I think if I had used the phrase “interpretations of reality” it would have more accurately reflected what I was trying to say. My impression is that the Zuckerman books tend to be more outward-looking at the enviornment he is in, while these novellas emphasize the more introspective side of the central characters.

Part of the reason that I think this, of course, may be that the Zuckerman novels that I remember and prefer are the ones where he is more of an observer than the others — which means I may be making a circular argument.

]]> By: Trevor http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2326 Fri, 22 Jan 2010 17:31:43 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2326 I’m intrigued to think of the Zuckerman books as exploring a version of “reality,” Kevin, since several of them deal with the process of conciously fictionalizing reality, particularly The Ghostwriter, Counterlife, and American Pastoral. Even Exit Ghost, with its biographical angle, runs around with the idea of fictionalizing a reality — of course, in that book Zuckerman is also creating an imaginary relationship with his female tenant.

That said, I think there’s validity in the idea that they are exploring a version of “reality” and contrasting what they do with what these later books are doing. And if we throw Plot Against America in there . . . I’ll have to think on this more.

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2325 Fri, 22 Jan 2010 16:48:56 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2325 I may be over-interpreting but I have wondered in this current novella series how much Roth may have been influenced by Camus — or at least might be reflecting similar concerns. The context of the absurd is one element (“The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth” was Camus’ summary). Equally important is an idea of dualism (dark/light, happiness/sadness, life/death) that Camus’ thinking evolved into. Where I do think that helps is in allowing Roth some of his excesses (the implausibility of the Peegan relationship here, the panty raid in Indignation) which some critics have found unacceptable. You know the Zuckerman novels better than I do but it seems to me they explored a version of “reality” — in some ways, this group seems to be distilling that into more fundamental ideas.

]]> By: Trevor http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2324 Fri, 22 Jan 2010 14:58:21 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2324 I remember you talking about “The Myth of Sisyphus” before, Kevin. I still haven’t read it, unfortunately, and I need to fix that, but I’ve heard enough about it to know that it also deals with the question of suicide when one comes to the knowledge that life is absurd. What an interesting perspective on this book! I wonder if Roth had Camus’s essay in mind a bit while writing The Humbling; it wouldn’t surprise me.

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2322 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:23:53 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2322 I’m not sure I agree with The Millions’ conclusion that Axler was a mad man in this book. In “The Myth of Sisyphus”, Albert Camus posits that drama is one way of escaping the absurd that dominates real life — the play becomes a new, non-absurd reality. Axler’s life has been spent in that artificial reality (and he was very, very good at it) and now that he has lost that skill he is stuck with the “absurd” — and makes one final escape by becoming a Chekhov character. I thought about that Camus metaphor often while reading the book and it definitely provided a structure. I also think viewing this book in the context of Everyman and Indignation there is reason to look for some sort of metaphor. For me, most of the negative reviews have neglected to do that (“lazy” is a fair description).

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2321 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:13:48 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2321 Here’s the review at The Millions that Trevor mentions in his comment.

]]> By: Trevor http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2320 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:38:06 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2320 Did you read the review I linked to at The Millions? I tried to link to it here for you, but whenever I do that your page discards my comment. Anyway, I like how the reviewer puts Roth in context and shows that this is a well controlled, structurally ambitious novella. Whether you like it or not is one thing, but to say it’s lazy is — well — lazy. This whole sequence of novellas is getting better with time for me. I think I’ll reread Everyman sometime soon (not too soon, though, too much else to read).

]]> By: Rick P http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2319 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 20:45:25 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2319 I’ve begun on the Zuckerman books. Even though Ghost Writer and Zuckerman Unbound were short, they took me quite a while to finish. I enjoyed them but I found them very dense. I’m really finding them rewarding but it’s heavy thematic stuff.

I believe I will follow your advice and take a break after The Prague Orgy.

I’m definitely glad I’m finally reading Roth.

Thanks

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2317 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 16:33:09 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2317 Colette: I agree that one of the intriguing things about The Humbling is the way that Roth, in effect, dares the reader with “trust me on this improbability and I’ll deliver” and then does. I can understand why some people don’t like this book — I too thought it was excellent and it has got even better in memory since I read it, which is always a good sign.

]]> By: Colette Jones http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/2009/12/04/blog-tribute-3-the-mookse-and-the-gripes-the-humbling-by-philip-roth/#comment-2316 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 08:06:45 +0000 http://kevinfromcanada.wordpress.com/?p=2294#comment-2316 What a fantastic book The Humbling is. Like you, Kevin, I suspect my interest in the theatre helps here, but I also just loved his inability to understand why the 40 year old girl’s parents did not like it that she was with him.

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